Following the program on this topic two weeks ago, Rob Hattam and Marie Brennan discuss how Australia's policy regime silences the voices of teachers who are treated as mere technicians who should just carry out instructions. In this regime teachers are treated as stupid, requiring dumbed down instruction about what to do in classrooms.

Rob and Marie offer an alternative way, based on good social science, rather than the pseudo science spouted by our leaders. Based on his extensive research about 'what works' in teaching, Rob says that social science refuses universal truth claims (or 'laws' that work in every case), instead paying attention to context, and documenting and exploring what works in a particular place.

Rob and Marie discuss how a good social science approach would involve teachers and students as researchers, in their teaching-learning contexts. Both have worked with teachers as researchers, and this has been essential to finding new ways to address challenges for schools and students.

Finally, Rob talks about his project work supporting teachers as researchers to build new knowledge, particularly to build culturally responsive curriculum and teaching practice.